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 Post subject: Legality?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 04, 2004 15:55 pm 
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Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2004 17:09 pm
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Location: Tampa FL
I've considered converting the FATK HLP file to CHM and then updating it so that it is actually useful (maybe as a collective project?). I'm willing to do the work and take the time to make it the help file it should be. I would never charge for the work I do. The big question is: since the company no longer exists is it legal for me to post the final product?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Dec 04, 2004 22:01 pm 
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First I am not an expert on copyright laws, but do have some limited experience with these issues.
It is my understanding that if you can make a mod or addition that can stand alone and install itself to a previously made product that's OK.
IF ..... you must create a new version complete with said help file you are in a gray area since if you use their product name or title you may well be infringing on their copyright.
If you create a new version and re-title it and the only changes are a new help file you definitely are infringing on their copyright.
What is at issue is what is actually copyrighted.
I.E.
They can not copyright the ideal of a toolkit, that is if someone was to create a new toolkit that does not use their program and or actual program process that would not violate their copyright.
Say the first guy that ever made a flight sim could not say every flight sim from then on would violate his copyright.
For all we know they may have only copyright protection on something as simple as the name of program. Or They may have protection on some actual program line or language like a source code to program.
But after a quick look it appears that even if you could make a separate help file in order to install it you would need to use their name at least for the help file to get it to directly replace the original one.
Also be aware that unlike a patent copyrights to titles name and images do not have any time limitations.
Even if you do some how infringe on a copyright your intent plays a big part in the severity of violation.
Say you used a brand name like McDonalds ....
If you used it for your monetary gains that's a major infraction. If they could show cause that your usage diverted business from their product that's also a major infraction. The fact that at one time you could not get it anywhere else from the creator and the key code, but that now today you can get these anywhere and they have let this practice continue, and even more important that they no longer provide support for it, to a large they have given up the "protection" and "defense" of their copyright lends me to speculate that as long as it was not done for profit the worse that could happen would be they could force you to withdraw it and stop any distribution. At this time they could not show any monetary loss due to your actions.
You must ask yourself these questions?
Where can you get the Toolkit, you can't get it from them, so you are not "stealing" any traffic or commerce from them.
At this date one could theoretically remake their product and distribute it without a key code function with little fear of repercussions.
What you could not get away with would be something like using it or a modification to make a toolkit for a popular sim like IL2 and then try to make a buck off it ... you can bet if the creators found out they would make a claim.

In short I'd say although technically maybe illegal it would not be without precedence and the repercussions would only be to withdraw the version you are contemplating from distribution if there was any complaints made.

The key word here in the end is INTENT.
That is what is compelling you to make and distribute another version.
The next issue would be the matter of DAMAGES your version could cause the creators of original.
And lastly their ability to SHOW ANY DAMAGES that said new version DID ACTUALLY cause.

In summary I'd have to say YES you would be violateing their copyright BUT if it mysteriously showed up somewhere as the "FA Toolkit with working help file" and there was no way to trace it back to you, what the heck could anybody do about it ?
How would anybody even know where it came from ?
And once out and on FA sites all over how could they ever put the Genie back in the bottle ?

With the last series of questions you must ask yourself something.
Are you willing to do the work and NOT add any credits to it that would point back to you ?

these are just some opinions from a guy that went head to head with EA over some dumb ass shit back in 99' over what they considered improper use of their logos and images on a web site. In that particular issue they could NOT show INTENT or CAUSE and it was only my provider GEOCITIES that chickened out and pulled site. If I had really wanted to I could have found a provider that would have let the site stand. And if you don't think I don't practice some of what I preach check this out, although just a goofy little messageboard I know of a lot of MB's that would not do it .... And screw UBI Soft ... LOL.

NO CD GAME CRACK POST ......
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I'm trying to get a collection of No-CD Game Cracks going,
posted online for download.
Please check out this post and help if you can.
The No-CD Game Crack Collection Post
I'm especially interested in posting cracks for the JANE's titles.
But I'll post cracks for any popular games.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Dec 08, 2004 20:04 pm 
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Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2004 17:09 pm
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That's what I was afraid of, a legal gray area that can be used against you. I'll have to think about this one. Besides, someone will probably beat me to it anyways. They always seem to.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Dec 11, 2004 22:34 pm 
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Well actually, I think you will find that almost all of the major editing in FA (like my FAF series) doesnt even use the FATK anylonger due to its accute limitations...

The toolkit doesnt address enough of the objects to really be anything but an outline for compressing files into appropiate libraries for FA to use. For detailed work its simply to limited...

CAG out...

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Dec 12, 2004 23:30 pm 
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Ya probably told me alredy but what methods do you use?

The help file will still be useful for editing-rooks like myself.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 14, 2004 16:49 pm 
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Hex editing, assembly programming, and text editing...

MS Paint, Paintshop Pro, Sickpuppy color editior, 32 bit hex editor...

Plus other assorted tools to accomplish this...

CAG out...

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FAF/FA-2 Design team
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FA Futures/FA-2 is Still Being Worked On and Will Be Released...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 22:16 pm 
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He He WOooo thats a doozy

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 20, 2004 23:52 pm 
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Joined: Mon May 05, 2003 21:38 pm
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Location: Dallas Texas
I know the compression format! It's just an LZW implementation! How to implement it? I dunno. But If you look at the way the libs are arranged, there's a big fat header on it with file names, and... Positions in the file, where each one starts...

Woo!
:D

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